Redditch Tabletop Gamers Forum

So had a game against Ben yesterday and we had different opinions on how the ravenwing rad grenade works. Just like to point out first it had no bearing on the actual outcome of the game - I got hammered, cursed Eldar!

Black knights with grenade launchers can choose to fir a rad grenade, which if it hits makes the unit -1T. My understanding is that this comes into effect immediately and therefore affects the roll to wound of the rad grenade itself and the plasma talons of the rest of the unit - this is how I've been playing it. Ben's understanding was that it only affected subsequent units shooting/assaults.

I thought that as soon as the grenade hit, the unit was -1T. Then you roll to wound, which comes after, hence affecting the units own shooting.

Soooo...what's the right answer?!

Can anybody give me a definitive answer, I don't want to be playing it wrong and similarly if the way I was playing it is right I want to be able to be confident I've got it right.

Yeah, i was looking into this too afterwards, i cant find what i thought was an FAQ (as in an official GW one) on it so i guess i'm misremembering (and for that i apologise). However i still think, and have always played, that the -1T takes affect after the knights have finished shooting therefore has no effect on their rolls to wound. For me everything fires at the same time so the -1T would be after that lot of shots.

Im not sure there is a definite answer.

The more i read the more i think i've got this wrong.

my thoughts were along these lines

Quote:All shooting from the unit is simultaneous so you'd be hitting and wounding at the same time. The next unit would wound against the lower toughness.

however all the counter arguments seem to mention scarabs as precedent? not quite sure what that means...

and that because you roll for hits and wounds separately they occur separately. to me that still makes no sense but it does appear that i've been playing it wrong now for many months.

sorry again Chris, as you said don't think it would have made much difference, but you never know.

No worries Ben, as a fellow dark angels player I guess it's of interest to you as we'll. I think it comes down to the sequence of events and that yes all the shots hit simultaneously but the roll to wound is made after the shots have hit.

The scarab thing is that entropic strike works instantaneously. The scarabs hit the vehicle, make a roll for entropic strike for each hit to see if the AV value is decreased, and the roll to glance/pen on the new AV value. So that is pretty much the same deal, the roll to 'damage' comes after the roll to hit.

yeah makes a massive difference to how i've been using the Black knights with a grenade.